AFL 2012

[Nines]

On the first two points, feelings of antagonism between supproters of rival codes is not unique to Sydney or even to RL fans.

You've just backed up my point about the lack of tolerance in Sydney.

As for your other points, you're confusing tolerance, acceptance and welcome.

[Jeffles]

On the first two points, feelings of antagonism between supproters of rival codes is not unique to Sydney or even to RL fans.

You've just backed up my point about the lack of tolerance in Sydney.

Hold up. Stick to the conversation. You raised those four points as "evidence to the contrary" (your words) to the assertion that Sydney "supports, wants or encourages" other sports and is one of the "most accepting cities on Earth" (my words) when it comes to multiple football codes. My assertion is an inherently a relative point (evidenced by the use of the term "most"). I.e. you, nor anyone else, can disprove it by pointing to the presence of factors such as hate etc that are not unique to the city.

Look at it in relative terms. There are pockets of sports fans in all cities that are antagonistic to rival sports. Pointing to the examples you gave, at best, proves that in many ways, Sydney is like many other cities in the world, but by those examples alone, you cannot say in a relative sense, it is less accepting than other cities. If you want to make a point, show that Sydney's "hate", where it exists is worse than other cities in number and intensity. Now, in a relative sense, Sydney has shown itself to be at the top of the pile when it comes to embracing multiple football codes for the reasons I've outlined.

It begs the question, Nines. Is there a city in Australia you think is more tolerant, accepting, supportive, encouraging of multiple football codes? What is your evidence?

[Simmo79]

See your mistake was to engage him in a rational and considered debate. Nines is the conversational equivalent of a drunk hillbilly sitting on his front porch firing his shotgun at the dang moon. Best just to keep on driving.

[nobleoz]

Brisbane definitely wins the best & fairest. All codes are given good space in the media & all get good crowds.

[Jeffles]

Good point. There is a case to be made for Brisbane too.

[yob]

See your mistake was to engage him in a rational and considered debate. Nines is the conversational equivalent of a drunk hillbilly sitting on his front porch firing his shotgun at the dang moon.

You gotta be kidding me. He lives in Goulburn?!

[Nines]

It begs the question, Nines. Is there a city in Australia you think is more tolerant, accepting, supportive, encouraging of multiple football codes? What is your evidence?

Tolerant or accepting just means that there are enough supporters to make a code viable.
Supportive and encouraging means that non supporters have a positive association.

Perth people are very parochial and feel positive towards an entity representing the state.
The state government has spent a lot of money to attract RU and install soccer in a decent stadium and is encouraging to any rl overtures.
WA people are probably the most indifferent.
Most don't know the fifference between RU and rl. WA supports 3 football codes and is very active in baseball and basketball.

Brisbane supports four football codes and generally seems to support a multitude of other sports.
For all round knowledge and support at local and government level I'd probably give it to Brisbane.
At a personal level, the people I've met pretty much live and let live.

Sydney supports four football codes. Things have changed a bit maybe due to weight of pressure.
Only recently the government has spent some money on AFL facilities.
Media is at best uninspiring and and there little cross code friendliness.


Melbourne supports four football codes and the supporters of each code seem to be very
enthusiastic and indifferent to other codes. Certainly, if you want to make friends in Melbourne, then just starting talking football. And yes, some AFL followers hold negative views to other codes. The Vic. government level welcomes as much sport as possible.






......

[nobleoz]

Given that the recent NRL trial in Hobart was supported by the local footy club, you would have to put Hobart in. Based on press attitudes & community response: 1st = Brisbane, then Hobart, then Melbourne, then Perth, then Canberra, then Sydney. Adelaide can't rate because it doesn't have an NRL team, nor much of a local RL comp.

[Jeffles]

That's funny, nobleoz. Adelaide has a bigger RL comp than Hobart over a longer period of time and it has hosted countless more NRL games. Yet because of RL you rank Hobart 2nd give Adelaide a "N/A" because of RL.

I don't understand why Sydney is so low on that ranking. They came to the party on all four codes long before any other city and Sydney continues to support its teams.

Sydney supports four football codes. Things have changed a bit maybe due to weight of pressure.
Only recently the government has spent some money on AFL facilities.
Media is at best uninspiring and and there little cross code friendliness.

I must take issue with this.

Governments in NSW have always been supportive of AFL, relative to the demand for the sport. FFS, Erskineville Oval was reconfigured in the 1930s to a more AFL (sic) friendly layout.
Media, although often sensationalist is more pluralistic in Sydney than in other cities. The "other" sports coverage on 702 ABC Sydney, the Daily Telegraph and commercial radio comapres favourably to the Herald Sun, SEN and 774. As for cross-code friendliness, I can only point to anecdotal evidence. I saw English soccer and A-League shrits at Penrith last Saturday night, there's a clique of fans I see at most games that follow the Jets and the Swans.

Every city has arseholes, but for some reason you bloeks like to think they represent Sydney more than arseholes in other cities are representative of those localities.

[bazza]

The NSW government built an AFL quality Victorian Rules ground long before the Swans came to Sydney

[Simmo79]

And GWS had a league ground and a training ground built for them before they'd played their first game. You'd have to have quite a chip on your shoulder to think that was being hard done by.

[Nines]

Erskineville Oval was reconfigured in the 1930s to a more AFL (sic) friendly layout.

Pease set the criteria.
What period are we talking about.
Historically AF was locked out of grounds by RU.
Both AF and rl was effectively banned in some schools.
Erskine Oval was improved for AF. Wow.
You forgot to mention the SCG was offered to the NSWFL.
Those were better times probably up to the introduction of TV.
Now people are jumping ahead to Blacktown and the Showgrounds.
As I said, they are very recent developments any not a lot of money especially compared to the $billions spent on other sports earlier.
Perth has spent more and has more earmarked even more to entice rectangular sports.
Melbourne built Docklands and now the MRS for rectangular sports.
Brisbane rebuilt the Gabba and now the GC upgraded Carrara.
Sydney charged the AFL to modify Homebush.
Blacktown was only $10.5 million of which cricket gets the major controll.
The Showgrounds are about $30 million I believe.
When the Swans came to Sydney they were charge $500k for 11 games at the SCG.
When the SFS was built rl was charged only $100k for the season including finals.
Some rl teams are paid to play at Homebush, whilst the Swans are charged premium prices.
Sydney may have four professional football codes but in all reality it hasn't done much for three of them. it's nothing like melbourne which has built a sports precint and the MRS promotes the rectangular codes along with a mulitude of other sports.
If Sydney had not had the Olympics it would be still in the sports dark ages.
When you get down to grassroots level it's an even worse story.
All the other states bar NSW have adequately provided facilities for other sports.
But you are right, things are changing now, ever so slowing, but imply it was sort of multi-cultural celebration of all sports but more a begrudging acceptance that there was political mileage to be made.

[Simmo79]

You have quite a sense of victimhood for a supporter of the largest and best run league in the country. I'd hate to see your list of complaints if you supported another sport.

[Nines]

You have quite a sense of victimhood for a supporter of the largest and best run league in the country. I'd hate to see your list of complaints if you supported another sport.

But I do support other sports.

[nobleoz]

Jeffles, I rated Hobart so highly because it was an AFL (sic) club that sponsored the Storm game. I doubt that has happened in any other major city. And in reverse.

I think Adelaide's RU competition is bigger than RL. Certainly it's existed since I was a kid, with it's own ground (Bailey Reserve). Both comps are bigger than Hobart, but not by % of population. Perth will have an NRL side before Adelaide, so Adel is way down my list.